Trade down with Rams?

[FTLDOLFAN]

They have 2 2nd round picks, #43 and #45. They might want to trade up for Lynch or Goff since they need a QB. Would you trade down to #15 for the #45 pick in the draft? If Ramsey and Hargreaves are both gone then I would do it. Then how would this draft look?

R1. DE Emmanuel Ogbah - If we resign OV then we will have a formidable pass rush.

R2. DB Kendall Fuller - Some analysts believe he is as good as any corner in this draft but will slip due to his injury.

R2. OG Cody Whitehair - We solidify our o-line with an elite OG prospect.

R3. LB Joshua Perry - He would replace Koa Misi as our SAM LB but he also has the size to play ILB if needed.

R4. OT Tyler Johnstone - Depth for our o-line.

R5. LB Blake Martinez - An instinctive ILB who was a tackling machine for Stanford last year.

R6. FS Jamal Golden - Some depth for our secondary.

R7. DT Joel Heath - Some D-line depth.

R7. QB Jake Coker - Developmental QB.

[cuchulainn]

That draft would rock IMO... Obgah isn't my first choice for a DE, but he's got as much potential as anyone. I'm still not sold on retaining OV.

Love the Josh Perry and Blake Martinez picks...

[Alpha]

I particularly like Martinez.....and Scooby Wright in this draft.

[FTLDOLFAN]

That draft would rock IMO... Obgah isn't my first choice for a DE, but he's got as much potential as anyone. I'm still not sold on retaining OV.

Love the Josh Perry and Blake Martinez picks...

Thanks, I'm glad you liked it. If you don't want to resign OV then would you want to bring Wake back? I think we should bring one of them back. OV is younger and has proven to be a solid pass rusher. I know he can be a bit of a knucklehead with his penalties. Either way though we still need to add another DE with some pass rushing skills. I just thought that Ogbah would be a good value pick at #15 although its possible he might not even be available then. I know you prefer Shaq Lawson and I would be happy with him too at #15 but again its possible he might not even be available then.

[AquaXI]

I hear mixed reviews on Lynch. Not to say he isn't a 1st rounder but because he struggled in the Bowl game against the big boys and played in a small conference he may not be worthy of a top 10 pick. He may actually be there at 15. But I also think your draft rocks.

[cuchulainn]

Weak QB class overall. I like Lynch, but don't love any of these QBs. They are all projects in this draft with Goff being the cream of the crop. Carson Wentz is the wild card. He has some things to clean up like Lynch does, but he flashes some big time talent. He plays at NDSU where we took Billy Turner and QB, Brock Jensen from...

[Driven_Phinsane!]

First, let me apologize firsthand because i don't watch enough college football to know who half those guys are, lol...I do like Ogbah from Ok. State, but he could be gone as well (several mocks i've seen have Ogbah as a top 10 or so pick) by the time we draft @ #15 if this trade were made (Pass rushers are always a premium and tend to fly off the board, i remember when the 'Hawks surprised everyone & took Bruce Irvin in the 1st)

I know our DE situation is up in the air right now and how high a priority it becomes will obviously be dictated by the Wake & the OV situation (Throw Shelby in there as well) We are so screwed at the CB & LB position's as a whole that it's gonna suck-ass if DE becomes a top priority as well...

I like Hargreaves and i get the feeling he's gonna be there at 8, but IMO when i've watched him, he's been a little too finesse for me - although there's no denying he seems to always be around the ball..I want a bigger physical DB (enough of these little guys who tend not to like getting their hands dirty) Ramsey would be an excellent choice, but i keep reading that his best position is Safety, i'm assuming he played the SS position before being moved last year to Corner & it just so happens that the only good DB we have is already at that position..If it's FS Ramsey excelled at, then we could definitely use him! Btw, i've seen Ramsey slotted all over, between top 5 to all the way into the 2nd round - One mock over @ WalterFootball has dropped him out of the 1st & into the 2nd stating that many NFL people they've talked to have him graded as a 2nd rounder. I like VT's Kendall Fuller a lot, good size & speed & with two NFL playing brothers, it's obviously in his blood..i do however think that even with the injury, he'll be gone by the time we pick in the 2nd (Might still even go in the 1st)

Personally, i still want a play-making LB with our first pick (Floyd from Georgia, Alabama's Ragland?? Even have to consider Jaylon Smith & Myles Jack, depending upon their injuries - though it makes me queasy looking at another player with a serious injury) IMO, we're not gonna get the ultimate benefit of Suh's play inside 'til we get a playmaker @ LB behind him..
Lastly, i'd like Coker in the 7th, but don't think he'll be there...

[cuchulainn]

Ramsey has all the makings of a ''special player''... despite being a nole... ;-) Unless some catastrophic happens, there is no way in Hell he drops out of the 1st round. I'd be happy if we could take Alexander AND/or Fuller. Both are more physical than Hargreaves and like pass rushers, you can never have enough good DBs. We saw the jets and bills do this before and in consecutive drafts.

I've wanted a stone cold killer at MLB for years... if we're drafting BPA we could finally get one in the first if Smith or Jacks are still on the board when we pick.

[Idahomer]

The only time I watched Hargreaves play he got burned deep for a TD. He's small, but I agree we need a starting CB in this draft so I'm fine with drafting him if he's the real deal. I would like him or a LB in the first round.

[Driven_Phinsane!]

I'd prefer a physical CB; as i said from what i've seen of Hargreaves he's legit, but he's been a bit too finesse for my liking..I want a CB who not only isn't afraid to be physical, he actually welcomes it...I still want a play-making LB with our first pick if there's one for the taking!

[DolphinsFreak]

Since the Rams have a 1st round pick and two 2nd round picks I wonder if they would be willing to make a trade for a four year starting quarterback in the NFL? Would they be willing to give up a 1st and 2nd for him? With two early 1st round picks and two early 2nd round picks the Dolphins could draft in the 1st Round - Vernon Heargrraves, (CB), Reggie Ragland (ILB), 2nd Round - Connor Cook(QB), , Sallique Calhoun (DE)

Cook will pick up on the game much quicker then their current quarterback. Use free agency to build an offensive line and all you need now if to fill a couple more holes and you have yourself a competitive team.

[NY8123]

There is no way Miami is getting a 1st and a 2nd for Tannehill. Even if they did end up with two 1st which is a stretch given that the only recent QB traded for 1st (in 2012) and a 2nd (in 2013) was Carson Palmer, I wouldn't draft Connor in the 2nd, I'd take Lynch in the 1st.

If Ryan Tannehill is worth as much as Carson Palmer that means he is also as good as Carson Palmer. I'm not sure I'd hang my hat on that post.

[DolphinsFreak]

I agree. There is no way the Dolphins are getting a 1st round pick for Tannehill.................because he is NOT a good quarterback, and that is the only reason.

[Driven_Phinsane!]

Since the Rams have a 1st round pick and two 2nd round picks I wonder if they would be willing to make a trade for a four year starting quarterback in the NFL? Would they be willing to give up a 1st and 2nd for him? With two early 1st round picks and two early 2nd round picks the Dolphins could draft in the 1st Round - Vernon Heargrraves, (CB), Reggie Ragland (ILB), 2nd Round - Connor Cook(QB), , Sallique Calhoun (DE)

Cook will pick up on the game much quicker then their current quarterback. Use free agency to build an offensive line and all you need now if to fill a couple more holes and you have yourself a competitive team.

You'd probably have to throw Herschel Walker in on that deal, lol...I say that because Minnesota made the worst deal in NFL history by trading a shit-ton of picks & players for Walker, it turned Dallas into an almost overnight dynasty..It wouldn't be epic-Herschel Walker type bad, but bad enough for the Rams to trade a 1 & a 2 for Tannehill..I'd be all over it if they were dumb enough to do it though, might give us the ammunition for the killer draft we need to put out the dumpster fire!

[DolphinsFreak]

You'd probably have to throw Herschel Walker in on that deal, lol...I say that because Minnesota made the worst deal in NFL history by trading a shit-ton of picks & players for Walker, it turned Dallas into an almost overnight dynasty..It wouldn't be epic-Herschel Walker type bad, but bad enough for the Rams to trade a 1 & a 2 for Tannehill..I'd be all over it if they were dumb enough to do it though, might give us the ammunition for the killer draft we need to put out the dumpster fire!

Well, if you are correct about this then Ryan Tannehill is FAR from being a franchise quarterback because any franchise quarterback is worth that much. As I mentioned in a previous thread the Redskins trade THREE 1st round picks and ONE 2nd round pick for a "potential" franchise quarterback. So, if a team wasn't willing to give up a couple draft picks for Tannehill, then teams do not believe he is a franchise quarterback right now, and they don't believe he will ever be one.

I agree with you, and then, that he is not a franchise quarterback and will never be one either.

[Alpha]

He isn't a Franchise QB just now. He has the potential to be one....but he's not cheap like a rookie, as young, nor will he be on the roster as long without a new deal. Therefore, a team won't want to pay for him as a Franchise QB or Top 10 pick rookie QB.

Veteran QBs that have yet to emerge bring 2nd - 4th round pick compensation if a team wants and pursues them actively - at least from what I've seen.

[DolphinsFreak]

Good Post.

[Driven_Phinsane!]

Well, if you are correct about this then Ryan Tannehill is FAR from being a franchise quarterback because any franchise quarterback is worth that much. As I mentioned in a previous thread the Redskins trade THREE 1st round picks and ONE 2nd round pick for a "potential" franchise quarterback. So, if a team wasn't willing to give up a couple draft picks for Tannehill, then teams do not believe he is a franchise quarterback right now, and they don't believe he will ever be one.

I agree with you, and then, that he is not a franchise quarterback and will never be one either.

I know there's a great divide among the fanbase regarding Tannehill; there's one side that believes he still has a high ceiling; get a great O-Line, run game & D to surround him, and he can be good enough to get us to the playoffs and beyond..Then there's the other side that believes what you've seen is what you've got, they believe that RT has pretty much reached his potential and think besides that, it's going to take years to build a great D, O-Line & run game, we need to move on and hopefully find a QB that can win some games on his own while continuing to build these other things as we move forward...

I used to be on the fence with RT, but now am firmly entrenched in the latter group..I still hope i'm wrong about him but i don't think i am...That being said, i don't think there's a team out there that would give up even a first rounder for Tannehill, let alone their top two picks...

[DolphinsFreak]

I know there's a great divide among the fanbase regarding Tannehill; there's one side that believes he still has a high ceiling; get a great O-Line, run game & D to surround him, and he can be good enough to get us to the playoffs and beyond..Then there's the other side that believes what you've seen is what you've got, they believe that RT has pretty much reached his potential and think besides that, it's going to take years to build a great D, O-Line & run game, we need to move on and hopefully find a QB that can win some games on his own while continuing to build these other things as we move forward...

I used to be on the fence with RT, but now am firmly entrenched in the latter group..I still hope i'm wrong about him but i don't think i am...That being said, i don't think there's a team out there that would give up even a first rounder for Tannehill, let alone their top two picks...

I absolutely hated the draft pick. Then I will admit I started to warmup to him a little bit. Then, U gave up completely on him. I just don't see what the guys in the other side of the fence see. I was hoping they were right and I was wrong but this past season was his "prove it " year and he proved he was not a good quarterback.

With enough draft picks and cap space it wouldn't take an extremely long time to build an o-line and defense that could help him out but this Filphins team has so many holes it will more than likely take way too long. People think I hate Tannehill but that is simply not true. I feel sorry for him. He has had a lot of bad luck, going back to college. Unfortunately his college career followed him to the NFL, and they brought their whole family with them to try and prove that he was worthy of acfirstvroundcpuck. (Sherman) you combine poor coaching with poor general managing who never thought that protecting your investment was a good idea, and you are destined for failure. It's not Tannehills fault that the Dolphins organization doesn't know what they are doing. He is the innocent victim in this scenario. JMO

[Alpha]

I just don't see what the guys in the other side of the fence see.

Here's what I see...

Back to back 4000 yard seasons, twice as many TDs as INTs, decent running ability, 85+ career QBR, he's still young and until this bad season (not just by him) improved each year. What other Dolphins QBs have been better?

No, he's not a franchise QB yet...but we've had VERY FEW as good ever and many many worse. He's a top 15 QB in my eyes....and I think he'll end up being better than that. We'll never know when he has no OL and is getting hammered all the time. Yes, some sacks are on him....but LOTS aren't.


Now watch this:

[cuchulainn]

Agree... we're looking at guy dealing with adversity every single season and who is still a better QB than given credit for. He puts up the same consistent numbers as Matt Ryan and is better than Alex Smith. He also performs well when given average pass protection, and who is tough as Hell. We also now know that his HC was working against him the past 2 seasons... if Grier fixes the OL and the defensive personnel, he should be able to get to a winning record and hopefully the playoffs.

[Idahomer]

I'm on this side of the debate as well. I watched Rogers, Manning, and Brady all struggle at some point this year when the oline play broke down. I don't think Tannehill is a guy that will put the team on his back and score 40 points to win a game when the defense isn't there, but I do think he's a guy that with a good oline, good defense, and some confidence built up (because he's not the most sacked and hit QB in the NFL) he could be solid and take us anywhere we need to go.

QB's who get drilled play after play like Tannehill eventually lose confidence and are thinking about getting hit versus getting the ball to the right WR. It makes them less likely to follow the route progressions and lock in on the primary WR. The "happy feet" syndrome we've all heard about for years is the direct result of pressuring and hitting a QB. Not a single season have we seen Tannehill with CONSISTANT protection throughout the season. We don't know what he can do if he could actually trust his oline to keep him clean. We've seen him may every throw at some point, what we haven't seen is consistency and I still believe that is something we just might see if the oline ever gets fixed. We had the worst rated oline in the NFL last season. No way can you blame Tannehill for the offensive failures when you have the worst rated oline in football.

[DolphinsFreak]

Here's what I see...

Back to back 4000 yard seasons, twice as many TDs as INTs, decent running ability, 85+ career QBR, he's still young and until this bad season (not just by him) improved each year. What other Dolphins QBs have been better?

No, he's not a franchise QB yet...but we've had VERY FEW as good ever and many many worse. He's a top 15 QB in my eyes....and I think he'll end up being better than that. We'll never know when he has no OL and is getting hammered all the time. Yes, some sacks are on him....but LOTS aren't.


Now watch this:

I have absolutely no need to watch any videos on him. I have seen every throw he has made and most of them more than once. It's torture watching him play the position. His stats do NOT impress me at all, not even a little bit. There is nothing you could post that could change my opinion of him. Like I have mentioned dozens of times, nobody but Tannehill can change my opinion of him. He has a ton of work to do on his fundamentals and Future Tannehill has the chance of changing my opinion of him but Past Tannehill has no chance of doing so. He is not a natural quarterback. If this owner and his cronies want to try and force a square peg into a round hole it should be interesting to watch.

I was one of the first to point out how frustrated I was the past front offices (Plural) NEVER brought in a QB coach with NFL experience. They allowed Sherman's son-in-law to run the show and that was a huge mistake. Then, they ignored my requests to bolster the offensive lines. (Again, plural) Even Tannehill supporters were ALL-IN on going after DIFFERENT POSITIONS, stating that our current players on the roster will be able to handle the o-line duties. Well, they were wrong! It's not my fault that Tannehill stinks. It's not my fault that the front office didn't hire a real QB coach or sign or draft offensive lineman. Almost every single guy that was available in free agency last season ranked in the top 15 of all offensive linemen. The front office dropped the ball, as per usual.

[Dolfan1]

"There is nothing you could post that could change my opinion of him."

Then just agree to disagree. Why continue to argue your side when you admit that you won't listen to the other side. It's not that you "Don't see" it's that you refuse to see.

[marino4ever]

well stated D1

[DolphinsFreak]

Here's what I see...

Back to back 4000 yard seasons, twice as many TDs as INTs, decent running ability, 85+ career QBR, he's still young and until this bad season (not just by him) improved each year. What other Dolphins QBs have been better?

No, he's not a franchise QB yet...but we've had VERY FEW as good ever and many many worse. He's a top 15 QB in my eyes....and I think he'll end up being better than that. We'll never know when he has no OL and is getting hammered all the time. Yes, some sacks are on him....but LOTS aren't.


Now watch this:

I have absolutely no need to watch any videos on him. I have seen every throw he has made and most of them more than once. It's torture watching him play the position. His stats do NOT impress me at all, not even a little bit. There is nothing you could post that could change my opinion of him. Like I have mentioned dozens of times, nobody but Tannehill can change my opinion of him. He has a ton of work to do on his fundamentals and Future Tannehill has the chance of changing my opinion of him but Past Tannehill has no chance of doing so. He is not a natural quarterback. If this owner and his cronies want to try and force a square peg into a round hole it should be interesting to watch.

I was one of the first to point out how frustrated I was the past front offices (Plural) NEVER brought in a QB coach with NFL experience. They allowed Sherman's son-in-law to run the show and that was a huge mistake. Then, they ignored my requests to bolster the offensive lines. (Again, plural) Even Tannehill supporters were ALL-IN on going after DIFFERENT POSITIONS, stating that our current players on the roster will be able to handle the o-line duties. Well, they were wrong! It's not my fault that Tannehill stinks. It's not my fault that the front office didn't hire a real QB coach or sign or draft offensive lineman. Almost every single guy that was available in free agency last season ranked in the top 15 of all offensive linemen. The front office dropped the ball, as per usual.

[Dolfan1]

And your reason for re-posting the exact same message was what exactly? Trying to make a point?

[DOLPHINSIN2008]

hmmmm trade down with the rams thread turns into another tannehill issue yawning